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Tag: t_joltParenting
lazy boy@@ limited comparative evidence #1200w
This blogpost is filled with contradictions and sharp questions. It subverts many of my academic parenting principles and observations.
Trigger: I told grandpa that “my biggest 反感 (frustration, annoyance, anger) … is not benchmark result, but his laziness, i.e. poor motivation/effort”.
Now I think primarily we were using our generation as benchmark. I have very limited evidence about his peers’ effort. So far, based on such sketchy evidence, we are using interpolation to gauge their effort levels and then criticizing/labeling boy’s effort level as [inefficient, feet-dragging, no-initiative, no positive feedback loop, no intrinsic motivation 不上进,不求甚解 …].
We do this to have a plausible explanation for his benchmark result. This is comparable to the early scientists’ explanations . Later evidence such as “两个铁球同时落地“ discredited those explanations and scientists went on to revise their explanations . No shame no guilt.
I now believe absorbency is an ability, not just an attitude, so this offers another a plausible explanation.
My framework/explanation of effort+abilities holds well. Note effort, abilities and benchmark results are always relative_to_fellow_students.
Jolt: thanks to my first hand observation, I know his effort level in the final months of P6 was visibly higher than p5 … P5 was similarly higher than P4. Remember P6 (even P5) was comparable to gaokao in terms of workload, stress, competition, often depicted as a 400m dash.
Q (Jolt): What if his twin brother scores well, like top of his class, using even less effort than dabao, and dragging the feet even worse than dabao? I always maintain that “if you are competent then no need to work so hard” (An elastic yardstick?) Consequently, would I focus more on benchmark result or laziness?
A: I think I would revise my perception of his effort/abilities. His effort level would NOT be tested in any benchmark so I won’t know how his effort/attitude/efficiency changes under high pressure. For an analogy, consider my localSys effort.
Remember Shanyou’s son in BostonU. Based on whatever little I know, this chap is very intelligent, but poor effort. He refused to study for SAT. However, in BostonU, he has been in Dean’s list 4 times in 2 years, so is it possible to achieve that without some real effort? No I don’t believe his fellow students would be so weak that even a poor effort would put him to top of his class. So I’m confident about my hypothesis that he puts in real effort, possibly less than fellow BostonU students and possibly more efficient. Shanyou said the lad is efficient and probably put in effort.
- Jolt: U.S. schools use GPA rather than state-wide benchmark. In a benchmark, a hardworking student in an average school would score very poorly but hey , she is the top student in her school’s GPA.
- Jolt: A top-percentile diligent student in one state could score poorly in California
- Jolt: A smart, diligent student in Australia or U.S. would score poorly in Singapore’s A-levels, but hey she is in the top 0.1% in her country. I would say Liu Yong’s prodigy daughter could fall into this category.
- Jolt: in HJC, I observed first hand that these top Singapore students are less hardworking and would score lower in a tough China exam.
- conclusion: as outside observers without knowing the local context, I would likely say these students are … lazy. I would say our judgement is mostly based on benchmark results.
Q: Competence (as measured by benchmark) — Looking into math competence, by Australian standard, boy could be quite competent, so perhaps he wouldn’t need to endure so much practice?
A: I believe his effort level could be lower than many Australian kids of his age. I believe his current benchmark competence is largely due to heavy practice (therefore his cumulative effort 积累) in Singapore. In other words, his past effort has been much higher than his Aussie counterparts, but his current effort is not spectacular. If he keeps his effort level low, then sooner or later he would become mediocre in benchmark competence.
A: I really don’t want to talk about JingHeng, but I guess his P6 effort was not higher than my son. He had a strong foundation built over the earlier years. (I had a similar experience — in grade 10, 11 I put in less effort than others. So if you look at the effort level in one year, you could find a contradictory evidence.) However, if his effort remains lower than my son’s, then he would be overtaken.
Q(jolt): I complained that his holiday time was decadent and wasteful, but what if he’s top of his class in Singapore? Would I say he is brilliant/efficient and should broaden his scope ?
A: I would still use the same words like decadent, not “efficient”. I would have my explanation/theory (based on effort/abilities) for his high benchmark performance. I believe my explanation would be abilities + low effort. However, it’s not possible for a careless/non-committed student to score high on Singapore benchmarks. I know from experience that many brilliant students in my class had to work hard to learn the patterns and avoid mistakes, across subjects.
Jolt: If I compare my level of effort to (the idealized image of) Rahul or DeepakCM, or some of those cramming/coding students, do I also deserve punishment? Looks like fundamentally, I’m still relying on benchmark performance to judge boy’s effort.
Jolt: If I compare all of the above against the 70-mile runner, then who do Not deserve punishment?
A: the key difference is, there’s no compulsory benchmark on running. In another world, where everyone must benchmark on jogging, then everyone would need to put in jogging practice.
— sense of urgency… In P6 he used to do his homework slowly till 11pm. I still rated him “lazy” because “inefficient”. Waipo saw the same pattern and said congcong was impatient with homework and she might be right. My wife is also “impatient”. So was I.
jolt: But what if Congcong is lower in benchmark competence? “Impatience”, “efficiency” would be inapplicable ! I would still say Congcong is motivated, diligent but with low abilities.
At work, I am similar to boy. I drag out my schedule and can be very inefficient even though I spent long hours in office.
jolt: But am I lazy at work? If I rate myself as inefficient/slow-pace but diligent, then so is my boy?
A: again, benchmark result is the deciding factor. I rate myself as careful, slow-n-steady because my quality is higher than colleagues’. If boy is slow but accurate, I would NOT say “lazy, non-committed, 不认真, 不专心,不求甚解”
— Compare his math with other subjects
jolt: His feet-dragging is worst in math. If we rate his math effort fairly High, then how do we rate his effort/abilities in science (and other subjects)? More efficient and much smarter? But i never feel that way, even if I were to say those words.
Ultimately, I’m comparing his effort/abilities against his peers, but I don’t know his peers beyond benchmark results ! Actually, i rate his math effort as poor, his math abilities as above_average. I rate his science effort and abilities as good, against a purely imaginative cohort.
! The only evidence I have is the benchmark result.
! In reality, it’s possible that his math effort is higher than his science effort.
top secondary schools may!!be suitable|accessible to boy
Note this is not a parenting principle.
1) boy doesn’t look like the academic type
2) boy lack the absorbency capacity, drive/motivation
In the abilities/effort framework, I see gaps on both fronts… More on the effort side. Effort does affect abilities, as seen in his math.
In middle schools I became ‘engaged’ at a much earlier age than my peers and developed my competitive Abilities.
who deserves more sympathy: parent^child #可怜
(In the base camp) The child is not deprived of anything if without a personal phone. Mrs Teo echos in her reply.
However, wife feels boy is 可怜.
I would argue that outside the base camp, the parent suffers quite a lot and deserves sympathy, as described in ..
Each time, my suffering is way too high, and it’s completely unnecessary , for something optional.
学习^behavior^超重: parent’s worst headache@@
For a typical parent, which headache is tougher?
- AA: Academic disappointments at my son’s mild level
- BB: health issues such as weight, fitness,,, at my son’s mild level
- CC: smartphone addiction at my son’s mild level
I feel at a worse level, AA would be harder as the consequence is bigger, affecting many family decisions.
BB and CC are less likely to become severe.
Therefore, I feel lucky that my main concern (CC) is not that hard.
t-spend For boy: facetime^hiking^prep drill
- The hours spent blogging on parenting + writing email (in Chinese) on tend to be calm
- The hours spent bringing boy out hiking tend to be more bonding. He opens up.
- The hours spent preparing questions tend to be more efficient
- In contrast, The facetime hours are supposed to be more effective, but often too intense to be effective.
- if I get to engage him without losing my cool, then the efficiency is usually quite good
- If I can’t keep my cool during the face time, then better avoid facetime.
delayed→earned higher-value degree: TsingHua^NUS #UChicago
See blogpost on Kun.H, LS and other students delayed by a year.
At age 17 to 19, I felt so bad about my delay in HwaChong. Now in my 40’s, looking back I earned a degree from NUS, better-known than all the Chinese universities “they” attended.
Fundamental to this outcome is the spectacular rise (in the league table) of NUS among Asia universities.
— how about the one more year in the 5Y degree from TshingHua? Clearly it was 1Y delay, so the students graduate 1Y later but why I never had any inferiority projected-onto these classmates?
Aha .. becasue TshingHua was desirable to most of my peers in China. I simply subscribed to that preference from the mass market.
Analogy — most Singaporeans seem to prefer Singapore condos, despite the low current income. To me, rental yield is the #1 factor, so I should NOT subscribe to the mainstream preference.
Analogy — most Chinese flat buyers prefer higher floor
Q: compare this 1Y delay in TsingHua vs my 1Y delay in HwaChong -> NUS?
A: the Chinese would think the TsingHua deal is better, because the Chinese buy that brand! On the job market outside China, I guess NUS has higher position, higher market value. English alone is a priceless advantage.
A: more importantly, NUS helped me and wife’s SG citizenship, which is worth 100 times more than a TshingHua degree.
Q: compare this 1Y delay in TsingHua vs my journey from HwaChong to UChicago?
A: in terms of branding, TshingHua is no match for UChicago. Just look at Nobel Prizes.
— TsingHua vs India Institute of Technology
( These colleges are vastly different, but it doesn’t stop people from comparing them.) They have very high standing in their respective domestic markets, but on the international competitive landscape, they are not that competitive.
— why focus so much on branding rather than quality?
Quality is too hard to compare between two colleges.
— https://www.channelnewsasia.com/commentary/failed-a-levels-academic-journey-singapore-673911 — The author (Raffles JC grad) spent 2 years in JC, then 2 or 3 years in poly, then 3 or 4 years in university. Lots of delays, but not necessarily a disaster, IFF the person handles it well. He probably graduated from university in his late 20s or early 30s. In the U.S. I was told many people go to college in their 30s, after they figure out what they want to learn.
skater: verbal abuse as motivation #w1r1
This revelation shed lights on how China/U.S./Britain/Japan etc produced so many Olympic champions. Not confined to China.
— brainwash “whatever it takes to win medals”
“I remember being nine years old and asked if I was willing to do whatever it takes to get to the Olympics. I said yes. There was no way I could have understood what I was saying yes to.”
What if it included sexual favor or sacrificing health?
— brainwash “you deserve it”
“Up until recently, I never acknowledged that what I went through was abuse. … I was led to believe that I deserved it.”
— brainwash “coach cares about your results”
some parents had justified the coach’s actions by telling her that he “cares about your results” and “he thinks you have potential”.
“There’s almost this validation that people try to attach to it for me. I didn’t agree with that but at the same time, it got to my head in the sense that if everyone’s seeing this and no one’s doing anything about it, how wrong is it?”
— brainwash “sacrifice”
“Skating is a very enjoyable thing and yes, it’s a very difficult sport and it requires sacrifice and hard work. But that should always be rewarding and not in a way that’s done to make the athlete feel miserable.”
Remember the American TigarMom and her daughters’ view on the sacrifice and misery.
— constant, daily verbal abuse, similar to my practice
the verbal and mental abuse was consistent and she cannot remember a time without it
— negative labels
The verbal abuse was daily, she wrote, being called “Lazy. Stupid. Retarded. Useless. And fat.” That criticism of her weight and diet led Yu to question her “value as an athlete”
— produce results for ..
“We’re children but treated as robots and machines that are produced to get results, and then discarded after we’re done getting results.”
But Results for who? For parents, the coaching organization, the country. Results are also valuable for the athletes themselves but these athletes can’t make a living from the results. Even the highly paid boxers and NBA superstars can’t. Even Olympic champions can’t. If you are regional champion, then results are pretty much worthless after you retire.
[[King’s speech]] resilience despite dependencies
There are individuals who don’t need to rely on others. They appear to be resilient in the lone wolf sense, but I don’t know how common they are, or how strong they actually are.
I guess in most cases, resilient people tap on a “support network” rather than act as lone wolves.
One of the most intimate illustrations is counselling, like sexual issues, phobias, obsessions, addictions, behavior issues. Optimism (in the Lone-wolf sense) is just a word, often a weak and ineffective word by itself. Positive thinking is .. ditto. In half the non-trivial cases, the individual needs guidance and a helping hand. Dependency yes, but that’s real resilience for real people.
Emotional intelligence and Resilience are two misunderstood concepts.
- EQ is way more than empathy; its foundation is self-awareness…
- Resilience is not bulletproof, as explained in resilience #WhyFactor
Today I want to focus on resilience in spite of dependency.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_King%27s_Speech#Plot says the King’s speech therapist was always present at King George VI’s speeches during the war… ?! When I look at it with my red hat or black hat on, I would say Bertie was a failure and weakling with a constant need for (permanent dependency on) his therapist.
Such a hostile, /derogatory/, pessimistic assessment is unfair to King George, who became known as a symbol of British determination to win the WW2. The King demonstrated tremendous inner strength during WW2 and the post-war /disintegration/ of the British Empire.
It’s not necessarily a sign of weakness to rely on outside help, on a daily basis, as long as the individual is making a real effort, fighting her daily battle.
- eg: Think of a weak student who needs constant help but also works hard on her own. I was a truly self-reliant student who doesn’t need as much help as my classmates, but that doesn’t make me a resilient student. In fact, those classmates (who depended on help) could come out on top, thanks to their resilience.
- eg: I think many musicians and creative artists are dependent on drugs, alcohol, smoking… I would say some of them are capable, productive in their creative domains.
- eg (fictional): Bane with his dependency on pain relief apparatus … is somehow feared as a strongman, but his dependency was proven to be his Archile’s hill when Batman attacked the tubes.
- eg (specific) : Chairman Mao is a strong man, but also a chain smoker i.e. substance dependency.
- eg (within my circle): Rahul is a determined, hard-working teammate I observed for a year+. However, you could say he has a mild addiction to gaming and tobacco.
- eg (within my family): my sis is a strong, tough, resilient woman. However, she had mild addictions to tobacco, overspending. I know her better than I know the other examples, but I tend to pass heavy judgement on her.
- optimism and longevity .. https://www.cnbc.com/2022/06/10/study-optimists-are-more-likely-to-live-past-age-90-heres-why.html says leveraging social support is associated with optimism. These optimist women are less likely to go it alone when facing adversity.
You are good enough for me i.e.your dad
I told a Cigna counselor that I would tell the 11 year old tanbin that “Nobody is perfect or superpowerful. Everyone of us is weak including my dad.”
Ted Turner reportedly felt he was never good enough for his father. I want my kids to know they are good enough to be my kids.
eg: when criticizing kids on piano effort, remember their current effort level is already substantial. piano demands a commitment.